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japhb .ask masak What's up with the IR clog spelunking? Is there a project afoot? 00:47
yoleaux japhb: I'll pass your message to masak.
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japhb .tell lizmat We once had OpenGL, because back when Parrot was the only backend, I wrote those bindings. Sadly it's been a while since I've messed around with those; maybe after I finish github.com/japhb/Terminal-Print/bl.../rpg-ui.p6 ... which, uh, may be a while. 00:50
yoleaux japhb: I'll pass your message to lizmat.
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Shin_ Hi all... 01:00
m: my @a = <a a b c>; my @b = (20,1,5,4); say sort({$^a cmp $^b}, @a); say sort({$^b cmp $^a}, @b);
camelia rakudo-moar 839e52: OUTPUT«(a a b c)␤(20 5 4 1)␤»
Shin_ so, is there a perl6 way to code a sorting for both columns at the same time,thag could take advantage of auto threading? 01:01
Like an Sql saying 'order by @a asc, @b desc' 01:03
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grondilu .values given sort *.key, (@a >>[=>]<< @b); 01:05
Shin_ Wow, that looks cryptic :) 01:08
And for 3 or more columns, what strategy is suggested. I just want to tale davantage of perl6 lazyness and autothreading if possible. 01:09
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grondilu your sort can not do parallelism by definition, so the only parallelism is in computing the sorting criteria. So you may just create a data structure with all sorting criteria in it, and to do so you can use parallelism. 01:13
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grondilu something like race @a.map( { $_ => [&criterium1($_), &criterium2($_)] } ); 01:15
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Hotkeys m: say (1..3 Z 1..3), (3..1 Z 1..3) 01:28
camelia rakudo-moar 839e52: OUTPUT«((1 1) (2 2) (3 3))()␤»
Hotkeys What's going on here ^
Why does an ascending range work fine with zip
But a descending range doesn't
Juerd m: say 3..1
camelia rakudo-moar 839e52: OUTPUT«3..1␤»
Juerd Heh.
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Hotkeys m: list 3..1 01:29
camelia ( no output )
Hotkeys m: say list 3..1
camelia rakudo-moar 839e52: OUTPUT«()␤»
Hotkeys So are descending ranges not a thing
Juerd Descending ranges don't really exist.
Hotkeys Whoops
Juerd You can use a generated list: 3 ... 1
Hotkeys Right
Thanks 01:31
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Shin_ Thanks grondilu 01:40
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MasterDuke is there a way for a grammar to get/know where in the overall thing it's parsing it is, i.e., the line number of the file? 01:47
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gfldex MasterDuke: you have to count line numbers by hand 01:48
MasterDuke ugh. not sure how i would do that in a grammar? 01:49
gfldex MasterDuke: i got some code for that somewhere, will take a minute or two
MasterDuke sure, np 01:50
gfldex MasterDuke: gist.github.com/gfldex/fcd52d39ae9...52d13717c0 01:51
make sure to count the line before doing any matching
MasterDuke cool, thanks 01:52
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R_I_D question: how am i supposed to be productive in another language now that i know about perl6? 02:04
timotimo we are very sorry 02:05
you can use Inline::Python and Inline::Perl5 (and Inline::Perl6) to share code between languages
so you can keep a few things in perl6
R_I_D Inline Python? youre kidding 02:06
thats awesome
timotimo it's a thing :) 02:07
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seatek i have gone from a day-long, seething loathing of grammars into excited happiness in a matter of 5 minutes. 02:11
i was thinking, what wholly inadequate documentation there is on them... if i ever figure it out, i'll write up some better. but now i realize how hard that would be. seems like it's one of those things that just has to "click" eventually. 02:14
now to start creating chaos with actions 02:15
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SmokeMachine____ Is there a way to get the $=pod from another code? 03:03
AlexDaniel seatek: I've always thought that docs.perl6.org/language/grammars is quite decent 03:20
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seatek AlexDaniel: it is if you already know about them. It jumps straight into Protoregexes without even talking about what Grammars even are, except to say they're a "data structure" made by grouping regexes 03:22
AlexDaniel seatek: haha 03:23
seatek yeah ;) 03:24
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seatek i'm still not clear in actions why the heck and when you'd use "make" even. 03:28
and i've read just about everything there is 03:29
AlexDaniel it's if you want to build AST 03:30
seatek i know it's supposed to create an "AST", but trying to find what that is I have no idea
yes, exactly what the docs said
AlexDaniel okay, well. Once you parsed something, you have a parse tree, right?
seatek sure -- that's all very new to me though 03:31
AlexDaniel now, if the data you are parsing is complex enough, it means that your grammar is probably a bit complex too.
seatek you have component parts stored in methods
AlexDaniel so chances are you'll get a lot of crap in your parse tree
seatek it looks like make is used on things that need to map array and such 03:32
AlexDaniel (to the point that it is not very convenient to work with it)
seatek yeah
AlexDaniel so you build an AST! Which does not contain as much information about the original text and how exactly it was parsed 03:33
seatek ah ok... strips it down a bit
AlexDaniel yea, and you can do some extra stuff there too, depending on your needs 03:34
seatek so basically with actions, you're taking the return value that comes out of TOP, yes? 03:35
AlexDaniel well, it will call a corresponding method for every rule/token/regex it matches, not just TOP. But the value you get from $match.made is from TOP, yes 03:37
seatek right :)
that took FOREVER to figure out.
i could just be dull :) 03:38
AlexDaniel no, it is indeed not that obvious 03:39
seatek i'm basically looking at grammars as a means to create data structures i can have predictable and consistent things to work with
AlexDaniel but if you try to write some basic parser you'll probably figure it all out
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AlexDaniel … or maybe some basic programming language, not just parser… 03:39
seatek yeah that's what i've been doing -- a basic REST construct as my plaything
with "made"... do you need to call that on things you've have "make"'d? i haven't really dug into those guys much yet 03:41
if make is just stripping things down, i don't see why you would 03:42
yet so many of the examples use it without saying why
you look up make -- and it says Sets the AST to $ast, and returns it. 03:43
ah! i understand! ;)
and made.... Returns the payload that was set with method make. 03:44
oh silly me ;)
and an ast is An AST or Abstract Syntax Tree is a partially processed representation of a program. 03:45
why would i want my action to become a partially processed representation of a program? I mean, I can imagine... but how do I work with that? 03:47
i'm not complaining -- i'm just sharing my journey... ;) 03:48
AlexDaniel m: grammar Foo { rule TOP { <int> ‘+’ <int> }; token int { \d+ } }; class Addition { has $.a; has $.b }; class BarAct { method TOP($/) { make Addition.new(a => $<int>[0].made, b => $<int>[1].made) }; method int($/) { make +~$/ } }; my $match = Foo.parse(‘42 + 60’, actions => BarAct.new); say $match; say $match.made
camelia rakudo-moar 839e52: OUTPUT«「42 + 60」␤ int => 「42」␤ int => 「60」␤Addition.new(a => 42, b => 60)␤»
AlexDaniel seatek: you might want to split that into a few lines :) 03:49
seatek AlexDaniel: exactly what I started doing :)
AlexDaniel I'm not sure if it explains anything, but that's the idea 03:51
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seatek i'm still trying to format it to read. emacs can't even help! :) 03:53
no, that's no help at all 03:56
thanks though
i need to be let by the hand with a lollipop and all i get is punk rock ;) 03:57
when this will be a help, i'll have come to understand what i need to ;)
oh wait 03:59
AlexDaniel seatek: well, you can always work with your parse tree if you want to
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seatek maybe if i stare at it for a while 03:59
AlexDaniel m: gist.github.com/AlexDaniel/15ac3d5...ffa3272cef 04:00
camelia rakudo-moar 839e52: OUTPUT«「42 + 60」␤ int => 「42」␤ int => 「60」␤Addition.new(a => SuperInteger.new(value => 42), b => SuperInteger.new(value => 60))␤»
seatek why are the 2 $<int>[*] things getting .made called on them at that point ... they were never 'make'ed
AlexDaniel seatek: they were
seatek they get maked if they come from the grammar automatically? 04:01
AlexDaniel no, there's a method BarAct.int
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seatek it knows to call that method? 04:03
AlexDaniel yes, by its name 04:04
seatek oh i see, because int gets pulled in from the grammar, then it's already been changed for the TOP method
so duplicate token names get put into an array automatically too eh? had no idea about that one. 04:10
AlexDaniel yes 04:11
seatek i don't understand how 'value' could come out 04:12
i mean, how it's added, yes... but how it's outputted i can't see that
AlexDaniel seatek: that's .gist of our object that we created 04:13
seatek just as an element of the data structure i suppose.
and then we just pick out the juicy bits we want 04:14
AlexDaniel committable6: gist.githubusercontent.com/AlexDan...c4/file.p6 04:15
committable6: help
committable6 AlexDaniel, Like this: committable6: f583f22,HEAD say ‘hello’; say ‘world’
AlexDaniel committable6: HEAD gist.githubusercontent.com/AlexDan...c4/file.p6
committable6 AlexDaniel, Successfully fetched the code from the provided URL.
AlexDaniel, gist.github.com/8bf643f794c8f3d1b0...bc0eb131dc
AlexDaniel I should have started doing it in reverse polish notation… :) 04:16
seatek no! :) 04:17
AlexDaniel yes, because to make it work properly with infix notation you'd have to basically build your predence table… :)
which is doable, but uhh! 04:18
seatek yes i've noticed how some simple things are complicated an some complicated get simple
AlexDaniel seatek: anyway, what I wanted to show here is that there is no “operation” in our AST
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seatek so really, it's a bit of a discovery to find out what you've created in your AST then 04:19
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AlexDaniel not sure what you mean by that :) 04:19
seatek i think i'll have to ;) to that 04:20
AlexDaniel seatek: but anyway, if you don't feel any need in AST then perhaps you don't need one in this particular task 04:21
seatek AlexDaniel++ this has been so incredibly helpful.. thank you so much
AlexDaniel just go over your parse tree and get what you need, that works too
seatek i think i probably don't at this point... but i'm going to anyway. i want to get this all feeling second nature
i can see how useful this could be in lots of stuff. i could have been done a couple days ago with this last task but keeping to regexes... but when i see a rabbit hole... ;) 04:23
and this seems so core to everythign in the language, so it seems worth the effort 04:24
AlexDaniel well, it is core, it parses the whole damn thing :) 04:25
seatek i would throw myself into the creek first, than trying to write that. 04:26
can't even imagine at this point 04:27
though i have briefly peeked ;)
AlexDaniel interestingly, one of the example in our docs abuses the whole AST to pass calculated values around… not sure if that's a great example 04:28
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AlexDaniel ast thing* 04:28
seatek there is all manner of voodoo going on in those docs related to grammars 04:29
i did at first imagine using grammars to do class factories directly in the actions, but have since second-thought that 04:30
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AlexDaniel anyway, I have to sleep :) 04:32
see you 🙋
seatek: and feel free to open a couple of tickets in doc repo
seatek: your complaints are correct 04:33
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AlexDaniel it should not jump straight into protos, that's true 04:33
and yes, it should have a bit more text explaining why somebody would need an AST
seatek i'll help write some up gladly. least i can do for your kind help AlexDaniel. thank you again 04:39
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samcv what do you guys use for terminal emulators on linux? i sorta use st and konsole, but st is way too minimal and konsole has problems displaying unicode text properly (cuts characters off and makes the line placement off sometimes for a larger character) 07:16
curious what you guys use
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moritz I use xfce4-terminal, mostly because it's the default on xubuntu 07:22
so far I didn't have any Unicode trouble with it 07:23
samcv hmm
i will try that then
hmm tried it and at least it doesn't glitch the spacing of the lines for tall characters like 「this」 but they still get cut off vertically 07:26
but i use a really tiny font
arnsholt I've mostly used gnome-terminal
But not with a tiny font 07:27
samcv a.uguu.se/fNSHlsqDwQHv_Screenshot_...202455.png
arnsholt Modern screens are big, so I can afford the luxury of a big font too =)
samcv hah
i only have 1366 x 768 on my laptop and it's what i use 95% of the time
arnsholt Hah! Apparently the corporate firewall doesn't like your site 07:28
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samcv heh 07:28
arnsholt, try this i.imgur.com/Tx2CaUq.png
it's a bitmap font so only one size. but i love it so much. can fit tons on my screen and it's pretty readable 07:29
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samcv i find it annoying as hell that st, which is only has 10k lines of code is the only one that actually renders text right :( 07:40
idk why it's so hard to resize too big characters to fit inside the box given that terminals are supposed to do monospaced fonts
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samcv tried terminator, termite, konsole, xfce4-terminal, yakuake, terminology, xterm, urxvt-unicode, roxterm. ugh 08:06
bonsaikitten mrxvt seems pretty ok 08:07
tabbed rxvt, mostly sane
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samcv well i've gotten urxvt working except only basically specifying the fallback fonts be like 1/2 the size they should be 08:10
if they're too big urxvt will just not show them at all :\ 08:11
other ones either cut them off or they go into the other lines
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samcv st is the only one that actually shows properly, and it even works for full width symbols too, but always makes sure the height fits. but fullwidth ones show wider than normal ones. i wish i could use the normal clipboard to paste into it though, and not do middle click 08:14
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bonsaikitten haven't seen that issue yet 08:15
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samcv bonsaikitten, maybe your font isn't small enough ;) 08:27
nine samcv: what version of konsole have you tried? 08:31
samcv hmm even with a bigger font xfce terminal will glitch if i type 🐧 as the first thing, and pad it with like 3 spaces of width and then backspacing over it won't remove the last thing..
i'm running the latest
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samcv i have konsole 16.08.2 running KDE 5.8 08:32
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samcv gonna try something brb 08:34
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samcv not sure why this isn't working, but konsole isn't doing my custom compose things in ~/.XCompose 08:38
QT_IM_MODULE is set to xim too other programs work, though in kate things like emojis insert but shows a ? box. but works in non qt programs. 08:42
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lizmat lizmat clickbaits p6weekly.wordpress.com/2016/10/31/...-в-perl-6/ 08:50
yoleaux 00:50Z <japhb> lizmat: We once had OpenGL, because back when Parrot was the only backend, I wrote those bindings. Sadly it's been a while since I've messed around with those; maybe after I finish github.com/japhb/Terminal-Print/bl.../rpg-ui.p6 ... which, uh, may be a while.
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[ptc] lizmat++ 09:04
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masak m: sub is-odd($n) { $n % 2 }; .say if 5 ff is-odd($_) for 1..10 09:25
camelia rakudo-moar 839e52: OUTPUT«5␤6␤7␤8␤9␤10␤»
yoleaux 00:47Z <japhb> masak: What's up with the IR clog spelunking? Is there a project afoot?
masak japhb: no, just ended up searching for stuff :)
er, I mean "officially, there's no project afoot" :P
what'm I doing wrong with the `is-odd` thing above?
I'm trying to highlight the difference between ff and fff
masak checks the test suite 09:38
m: say join "", (/B/ ff /B/ ?? $_ !! "x" for <A B A B A>) 09:40
camelia rakudo-moar 839e52: OUTPUT«Use of uninitialized value <element> of type Any in string context.␤Methods .^name, .perl, .gist, or .say can be used to stringify it to something meaningful.␤ in block <unit> at <tmp> line 1␤Use of uninitialized value <element> of type Any in strin…»
masak oh. precedence. 09:42
m: say join "", ((/B/ ff /B/) ?? $_ !! "x" for <A B A B A>)
camelia rakudo-moar 839e52: OUTPUT«xBxBx␤»
masak for some reason I expected infix:<ff> to be tighter than infix:<?? !!>
but they're on the same prec level -- hm 09:43
and right-associative
so... I don't understand why the parens make a difference there...
m: say join "", ((/B/ fff /B/) ?? $_ !! "x" for <A B A B A>)
camelia rakudo-moar 839e52: OUTPUT«xBABx␤»
masak anyway, the spectests deliver. the above is a difference between ff and fff 09:44
dalek c: acd772d | gfldex++ | doc/Type/Regex.pod6:
show how to declare named Regex

c: 9246bf3 | gfldex++ | doc/Language/functions.pod6:
index prefix &

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dalek c: b1e96ff | gfldex++ | doc/ (2 files):
name a sigil a sigil

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masak m: class A::B {}; class C { has A::B $.ab .= new } # RT #126975 10:08
camelia rakudo-moar 839e52: OUTPUT«===SORRY!===␤Could not locate compile-time value for symbol A::B␤»
masak one of these days curiosity is going to get the better of me, and I will have to check why that one doesn't find the "compile-time value for symbol A::B" :) 10:09
this works:
m: class A::B {}; class C { has A::B $.ab = A::B.new }; say "alive"
camelia rakudo-moar 839e52: OUTPUT«alive␤»
masak so it's gotta have something to do with the `.=` somehow
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jferrero m: say 4 == (1E12.log10 / 3).Round 10:31
camelia rakudo-moar 839e52: OUTPUT«No such method 'Round' for invocant of type 'Num'␤ in block <unit> at <tmp> line 1␤␤»
jferrero m: say 4 == (1E12.log10 / 3).round 10:32
camelia rakudo-moar 839e52: OUTPUT«True␤»
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masak m: say 1E12.log10 / 3 11:03
camelia rakudo-moar b5780f: OUTPUT«4␤»
masak m: say 4 == 1E12.log10 / 3
camelia rakudo-moar b5780f: OUTPUT«False␤»
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masak m: say 4 ≅ 1E12.log10 / 3 11:03
camelia rakudo-moar b5780f: OUTPUT«True␤»
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nicq20 Hello o/ 12:28
masak m: say "ohayo nicq20!" 12:29
camelia rakudo-moar b62321: OUTPUT«ohayo nicq20!␤»
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dalek c: 0acb8ea | coke++ | doc/Type/Regex.pod6:
use our standard phrasing here

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ab6tract long ago i started working on making (^) work with bags 13:34
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ab6tract anyone feel strongly about it? 13:36
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LeCamarade Hello, Perl 6; I have Raspbian on a Pi. The Rakudo is from 2014. Will I succeed in compiling one there, or is there a .deb somewhere? 13:39
The Rakudo from the repositories is pre-Christmas. I had trouble compiling before on thin machines like this one. Need I bother? Anybody done done it before? 13:40
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timotimo compiling on a raspberry pi will definitely require a bunch of swap space 13:41
and multiple days of waiting :)
debian's got debs for multiple architectures of moarvm as least, i think?
LeCamarade Right. So I will settle for a pre-compiled ... if I should be able to locate one. 13:42
lizmat github.com/nxadm/rakudo-pkg/releases